Baptism was a good topic...... haven't studied it too much but it looks like my post was rather long, haha.
Last night I had a bonfire out back with a few friends. We were discussing a few things. I had told one of them about a theory about something that happened in the garden of eden and we debated it last night with another friend, it was a good time. So, I guess I'll post it here and see what everyone else thinks.
So, In Genesis God told adam not to eat the fruit of the tree of the knowledge of good and evil. That's easy. at that point there was no Eve. The Bible never said that God told eve the rule about the fruit of the tree, so I assume that adam probably told her. When the serpent tempted eve with the fruit however, eve does not quite the rule correctly. She doesn't just say she's not allowed to eat the fruit from that tree, she tells the serpant that they are not even allowed to touch the tree. I assume that adam told eve that changed rule just to make sure that she wasn't tempted to eat the fruit. Or, eve changed the rule to keep herself away from the temptation of the tree's fruit. Which ever way it happened, the rule which eve quoted was not the rule that God gave to adam. This new rule which is meant to help eve to stay away from the tree is what I call "the fence".
"the Fence", metaphorically speaking, is anything which is created by humanity that is meant to keep us at a distance from something we should not be involved with. In eve's case, again, that something was EATING THE FRUIT, and the fence was TOUCHING THE TREE"S FRUIT. I think that it is our nature to assume that if we guard ourselves against something, it will be harder for that something to have an affect on us. In the cases of setting up these fences though I think that they cause us more problems than they help.
Let me explain a little. Let's say that someone is unaware of the fences that are set up. This person simply thinks that if the fence is crossed then something bad has happened. In actuallity the something that is bad may be quite a distance from the other side of the fence. The problem happens when there is a person who in their "weakness" crosses the fence, and then because they already think they have done wrong they just continue on their way until they actually are doing something wrong. The fence in this case assisted in makeing the person apathetic about their actions simply because the fence was crossed and unknowingly this person still had not actually done anything wrong, but because of the apathy...... something wrong was done.
Do you get what I am trying to say? I am saying that the fence is a negative thing. The fences are rules and traditions and requirements which we or the Church sets up without any direction given from God or without much thought as to what kind of affect it might have on the big picture. God certainly has said a lot in the Bible.... however if you take the dogmas and catechisms of churches around the world and in history you will certainly see beliefs that are not told to us by God to follow, however have been set up by Churches in order to assist us in our walk with God. These things however...... which I'd like some of you to mention and post on here for the rest of us......... do more bad than good and actually deter people from following God and Christ becuase of the legalism and systematic way which Christ's message is distorted and perverted. Most of these distortions and perversion were meant for good, however they were unneccessary and they no longer are considered to be fences but to be the actual way which God has communicated his truth to us!!!!!!!
It is absurd..... see if you can think of anything...... Ill post some on here after a while if no one responds.
Saturday, May 12, 2012
Jesus.......2
This is my answer to the last post I made.
Like I said I think that the so what question is the most important one I asked. I will then focus on that portion for the most part. First, I suppose it is obvious that I am a Christian, which in my mind means "a follower of Jesus". Many people would say that a Christian is "one who believes in Jesus". I find that to be insufficient and leads to the lukewarm Christianity that turns so many people off..... is that correct Harry? To explain what I mean read what follows.
First of all, Belief is something that involves a self understanding that is really just a conclusion that something is real or true. Just so I am being clear, I believe in Jesus.... mostly because a lot of historical evidence (and that is not just Biblical, but also through ancient historians like Josephus), my own personal experience (which you can refute in your mind if you want), and I suppose a certain portion has to do with my upbringing. Beyond concluding that I think Jesus was a real person... belief has little effect on how I live.
Now, once a belief is in place that belief only play out in a person's life if that person actually takes action on that belief. This is why I say that a Christian is one who follows Jesus and his teachings. So in order to answer my own questions I must explain to all of you what I think it means to follow Jesus. This is the most important part of being a Christian because it is the result of true belief, it is technically hand in hand with REAL belief. I guess then I conclude that if a person does not follow Jesus, or think on his teachings and try to put them in action, or if a person does not shape their lives around these things, then even though they claim belief.... they are not truly Christians.
Ok, now that that is out here we go.
My breakdown of Jesus' teachings mostly involve his actions. Since I think that actions speak louder than words (although the toungue is the most powerful weapon which affects the exterior, our actions reflect all that we are on the inside and thus we learn about who people are mostly by what they do and not what they say). In the case of Jesus I think that his words are in line with his actions, his words simply explain his actions. Let me start with the understanding that Jesus was a person that followed (and therefore believed, and vice-versa) God and his teachings. So all of these things that I write will reflect that which I believe is taught in the Torah and Prophetic writings or the Old Testament. The information I get about Jesus is mostly through studying the New Testament while using the Old Testament as a basis for who, what where, when, and why Jesus even is worth following.
A few attributes and characteristics which I will talk about are most of the things which draw me to following Jesus. He fully commited himself to Biblical Justice, Righteousness, Peace, Teaching and Discipleship, Real Prophecy, and Love. All of these things are based upon Jesus, in my belief, being and following God (being and following sounds weird, but the Bible does teach that this is possible and is so). So, as a Follower of Jesus the absence of a constant attempt at living with these attributes and characteristics leads me only to conclude that a person is not really a Christian, and in most cases has been misinformed about what Christianity really is (So, don't blame Christians for the poor stereotype that is given to us, blame those that call themselves Christians but may not truly be). (That may sound like I am being very harsh on hypocracy........ well I actually am I guess.)
BIBLICAL JUSTICE and RIGHTEOUSNESS:
Jeremiah 22:15-17 as well as the rest of the Bible ( this is just one of my favorite verses)
We learn here that what God is saying through Jeremiah is that knowing God is equated with judging the cause of the poor and needy. See knowing God is not reading the Bible and trying to found out as much as you can about him, it is about doing the works of God. Caring for those that need caring, loving those that need loved, helping the orphans and widows, helping the oppressed, serving the poor. Jesus showed this throughout his life by loving the prostitutes, taking care of the hungry, befriending the outcasts, caring for the lepers, the crippled, and so on. Jesus fed people who were hungry, comforted thoses who were in mourning, healed those that were sick, and saved those who were dieing. This is what Biblical justice is, this is what Biblical righteousness is. It is not what we have made it out to be. It isn't living our lives by a set of rules, it isn't by going to church every week and tithing, it isn't by making sure that you don't curse, it isn't by being a "Bible beater". It isnt by only listening to Christian music, it isn't by praying before every meal. Jesus taught us to be loving, Love God and Love your neighbor!!!! These commandments cover the entire law. Loving is what justice and righteousness is!!! Jesus showed us this and this is why I believe in him and why I try to follow him by living out my life that way. Not because I am supposed to, but because I actually do care and actually do love God, and everyone!!!
PEACE and LOVE:
Now that I sound like a hippy, I think that Jesus lived his life in a way that shows that we should live peacefully and with love, and not with revenge and force. Now, remembering all that I said in the post about the pledge and war (http://themindofquerns.blogspot.com/2009/05/i-pledge-allegiance-to-flag-of.html), I also turn to a few other things, and Jesus' crucifixion. Jesus allowed others to mock him and use force against him, he even told Christians that this would happen if they followed him. Paul even says that he takes all of the positives and negatives in his life, because of Christ, as nothing because of the joy he has found in Jesus. Jesus sacrificed himself, the utimate love, for all of us. During all of this he did not fight back, told his friends and family to not fight back, and took all that they gave him because he knew that love would prevail and that fighting back was not the way God had chosen as the path to live for humanity. In our lives we should be leading by his example and using forgiveness, love, understanding, "turning the other cheek". Remember to not judge unless you want to be judged, and to forgive because if you do not then you will not be. This even means in the immediate response to something someone has done to you. This would require then, a peaceful and loving response, and not a response that involves anger, hate, and violence (continue on...).
TEACHING and DISCIPLESHIP
Now without teaching and discipleship Jesus would not have impacted the world the way he did. The writers of the New Testament would have had little to write because without Jesus explaining himself and teaching why he did the things he did, it would have been hard to understand. In our lives it is our mission from jesus to spread the Gospel to those who have not heard. The Gospel is message contained in the Bible and the life of Jesus. Without living our lives the right way (like Jesus), and also attempting to help others to live in a similar way... the job we inherit as Christians is only have complete and we then cannot be considered to be followers of Jesus. The only way to be Christian is to live like Jesus, and that includes teaching about him and God, and trying to help other people understand the truth that comes from following his example. This is what I am trying to do here on this Blog.
REAL PROPHECY
I will probably post about what I think prophecy is in detail, but here is a short blurb about it. (Read "The Prophetic Imagination" by Walter Brueggemann to see more). Prophecy is not fortune telling, prophecy is not trying to tell people what their careers should be, what kind of money problems are going to be fixed, what building a church is going to buy, or simply some connection to God that gives a person the ability to see what is going to happen
From reading the phrophetic books, and learning about Jesus' life we can see that Prophets are those that God shows the injustice and unrighteousness, lack of love and peace, and wrongness of the world. These prophets are shown these things for a purpose. Prophets have this purpose, as well as a few other. They speak for God or God speaks through them to enlighten a blinded people to their wrongdoings and to their straying from the straight and narrow. Then Prophets show these people what the results of their actions are going to be. In the case of Jeremiah he told them what they were doing was going to result in God sending Babylon to destroy them. But Prophets are not done with revelation and condemnation. Prophets then show the hurting people what they can do to be saved, what they can do to change the results that have been shown to them. The prophet gives the people a new vision which teaches them again how God wants them to live. Then he encourages the people by showing them what God has planned for them when they listen and do what they are saying. The point of saying this is because Jesus was a prophet in himself. He lived to show what we as followers of God were doing wrong with our lives, he showed them what would happen if they did not change (death), and he also showed them a way out and a way that pleases God. He shows us, just as the other prophets did, the New Jerusalem and the reward for living with justice and righteousnes, peace and love, and so on.... He showed us the joy that comes from living for aand loving God and Humanity simultaniously and he also showed us how. We then must do the same thing. We do this by how we live, what we teach others, how we live in this world. We should be pointing out the injustice in our world. The hatred and killing in our world, the starving and disease in our world, the greed and selfishness in our world, and the idolatry and ungodliness which is infesting our world and churches!!! We as followers of Jesus have the obligation to show these things to each other and then encourage each other to do something positive about it. We know the result of these terrible things and we know the result of living like Jesus, so we must live as the carriers of Jesus' prophecy.
-------------------------------------
Ok, so after talking about these few things that I see in Jesus, do you see what I mean when I say that the so what question is the most important? Do you see what I mean when I say that our lives must be lived in a way that reflect our beliefs, or we don't really believe what we say? Being a Christian is much more involved than just saying you believe something, or feeling different when you say that you accept Jesus into your heart, or going to church, or being a SUPER CHRISTIAN...... It is a life changing commitment that affects all areas of your life. Following Jesus involves hard work, learning, teaching, living with justice, righteousness, knowing God then, loving all, living in peace with all, and informing others what they are blinded to, which is the truth of these things and the lies of what is happening in the world we live in.
This is getting too long, but this is my answer to my questions. I know it was long, but it required a very intense look into what I believe. I could have written a 100 page paper on this or an entire book to fully explain this all with Bible passages, other references, and philosophical understanding. The point is that Jesus is my guide and savior and my role model and I think that as a Christian we must live like him and if we do not, then we are not Christians.........
I think that if we as Christians did live like him, then we wouldn't have a problem with people thinking we are hypocrites, hateful, judgemental, crazy, illogical, stupid, or anything else because of the way we lived..... they would think this way only because of Jesus........ this then would be what Jesus called for. Right now people don't hate Jesus they just hate the Christian that the church has created, one who does not reflect Jesus, and who does not live with the things listed above, especially love.
This then is when joy can fill someone, when real peace inside can happen, this is what Christianity is all about, when we actually live like Jesus taught us to....... Even if you are not a believer in the spiritual life of Jesus...... can you see what I am saying about him as a human and his teachings and why following him is a reasonable thing and something that can have a postitive affect on this world????
Like I said I think that the so what question is the most important one I asked. I will then focus on that portion for the most part. First, I suppose it is obvious that I am a Christian, which in my mind means "a follower of Jesus". Many people would say that a Christian is "one who believes in Jesus". I find that to be insufficient and leads to the lukewarm Christianity that turns so many people off..... is that correct Harry? To explain what I mean read what follows.
First of all, Belief is something that involves a self understanding that is really just a conclusion that something is real or true. Just so I am being clear, I believe in Jesus.... mostly because a lot of historical evidence (and that is not just Biblical, but also through ancient historians like Josephus), my own personal experience (which you can refute in your mind if you want), and I suppose a certain portion has to do with my upbringing. Beyond concluding that I think Jesus was a real person... belief has little effect on how I live.
Now, once a belief is in place that belief only play out in a person's life if that person actually takes action on that belief. This is why I say that a Christian is one who follows Jesus and his teachings. So in order to answer my own questions I must explain to all of you what I think it means to follow Jesus. This is the most important part of being a Christian because it is the result of true belief, it is technically hand in hand with REAL belief. I guess then I conclude that if a person does not follow Jesus, or think on his teachings and try to put them in action, or if a person does not shape their lives around these things, then even though they claim belief.... they are not truly Christians.
Ok, now that that is out here we go.
My breakdown of Jesus' teachings mostly involve his actions. Since I think that actions speak louder than words (although the toungue is the most powerful weapon which affects the exterior, our actions reflect all that we are on the inside and thus we learn about who people are mostly by what they do and not what they say). In the case of Jesus I think that his words are in line with his actions, his words simply explain his actions. Let me start with the understanding that Jesus was a person that followed (and therefore believed, and vice-versa) God and his teachings. So all of these things that I write will reflect that which I believe is taught in the Torah and Prophetic writings or the Old Testament. The information I get about Jesus is mostly through studying the New Testament while using the Old Testament as a basis for who, what where, when, and why Jesus even is worth following.
A few attributes and characteristics which I will talk about are most of the things which draw me to following Jesus. He fully commited himself to Biblical Justice, Righteousness, Peace, Teaching and Discipleship, Real Prophecy, and Love. All of these things are based upon Jesus, in my belief, being and following God (being and following sounds weird, but the Bible does teach that this is possible and is so). So, as a Follower of Jesus the absence of a constant attempt at living with these attributes and characteristics leads me only to conclude that a person is not really a Christian, and in most cases has been misinformed about what Christianity really is (So, don't blame Christians for the poor stereotype that is given to us, blame those that call themselves Christians but may not truly be). (That may sound like I am being very harsh on hypocracy........ well I actually am I guess.)
BIBLICAL JUSTICE and RIGHTEOUSNESS:
Jeremiah 22:15-17 as well as the rest of the Bible ( this is just one of my favorite verses)
We learn here that what God is saying through Jeremiah is that knowing God is equated with judging the cause of the poor and needy. See knowing God is not reading the Bible and trying to found out as much as you can about him, it is about doing the works of God. Caring for those that need caring, loving those that need loved, helping the orphans and widows, helping the oppressed, serving the poor. Jesus showed this throughout his life by loving the prostitutes, taking care of the hungry, befriending the outcasts, caring for the lepers, the crippled, and so on. Jesus fed people who were hungry, comforted thoses who were in mourning, healed those that were sick, and saved those who were dieing. This is what Biblical justice is, this is what Biblical righteousness is. It is not what we have made it out to be. It isn't living our lives by a set of rules, it isn't by going to church every week and tithing, it isn't by making sure that you don't curse, it isn't by being a "Bible beater". It isnt by only listening to Christian music, it isn't by praying before every meal. Jesus taught us to be loving, Love God and Love your neighbor!!!! These commandments cover the entire law. Loving is what justice and righteousness is!!! Jesus showed us this and this is why I believe in him and why I try to follow him by living out my life that way. Not because I am supposed to, but because I actually do care and actually do love God, and everyone!!!
PEACE and LOVE:
Now that I sound like a hippy, I think that Jesus lived his life in a way that shows that we should live peacefully and with love, and not with revenge and force. Now, remembering all that I said in the post about the pledge and war (http://themindofquerns.blogspot.com/2009/05/i-pledge-allegiance-to-flag-of.html), I also turn to a few other things, and Jesus' crucifixion. Jesus allowed others to mock him and use force against him, he even told Christians that this would happen if they followed him. Paul even says that he takes all of the positives and negatives in his life, because of Christ, as nothing because of the joy he has found in Jesus. Jesus sacrificed himself, the utimate love, for all of us. During all of this he did not fight back, told his friends and family to not fight back, and took all that they gave him because he knew that love would prevail and that fighting back was not the way God had chosen as the path to live for humanity. In our lives we should be leading by his example and using forgiveness, love, understanding, "turning the other cheek". Remember to not judge unless you want to be judged, and to forgive because if you do not then you will not be. This even means in the immediate response to something someone has done to you. This would require then, a peaceful and loving response, and not a response that involves anger, hate, and violence (continue on...).
TEACHING and DISCIPLESHIP
Now without teaching and discipleship Jesus would not have impacted the world the way he did. The writers of the New Testament would have had little to write because without Jesus explaining himself and teaching why he did the things he did, it would have been hard to understand. In our lives it is our mission from jesus to spread the Gospel to those who have not heard. The Gospel is message contained in the Bible and the life of Jesus. Without living our lives the right way (like Jesus), and also attempting to help others to live in a similar way... the job we inherit as Christians is only have complete and we then cannot be considered to be followers of Jesus. The only way to be Christian is to live like Jesus, and that includes teaching about him and God, and trying to help other people understand the truth that comes from following his example. This is what I am trying to do here on this Blog.
REAL PROPHECY
I will probably post about what I think prophecy is in detail, but here is a short blurb about it. (Read "The Prophetic Imagination" by Walter Brueggemann to see more). Prophecy is not fortune telling, prophecy is not trying to tell people what their careers should be, what kind of money problems are going to be fixed, what building a church is going to buy, or simply some connection to God that gives a person the ability to see what is going to happen
From reading the phrophetic books, and learning about Jesus' life we can see that Prophets are those that God shows the injustice and unrighteousness, lack of love and peace, and wrongness of the world. These prophets are shown these things for a purpose. Prophets have this purpose, as well as a few other. They speak for God or God speaks through them to enlighten a blinded people to their wrongdoings and to their straying from the straight and narrow. Then Prophets show these people what the results of their actions are going to be. In the case of Jeremiah he told them what they were doing was going to result in God sending Babylon to destroy them. But Prophets are not done with revelation and condemnation. Prophets then show the hurting people what they can do to be saved, what they can do to change the results that have been shown to them. The prophet gives the people a new vision which teaches them again how God wants them to live. Then he encourages the people by showing them what God has planned for them when they listen and do what they are saying. The point of saying this is because Jesus was a prophet in himself. He lived to show what we as followers of God were doing wrong with our lives, he showed them what would happen if they did not change (death), and he also showed them a way out and a way that pleases God. He shows us, just as the other prophets did, the New Jerusalem and the reward for living with justice and righteousnes, peace and love, and so on.... He showed us the joy that comes from living for aand loving God and Humanity simultaniously and he also showed us how. We then must do the same thing. We do this by how we live, what we teach others, how we live in this world. We should be pointing out the injustice in our world. The hatred and killing in our world, the starving and disease in our world, the greed and selfishness in our world, and the idolatry and ungodliness which is infesting our world and churches!!! We as followers of Jesus have the obligation to show these things to each other and then encourage each other to do something positive about it. We know the result of these terrible things and we know the result of living like Jesus, so we must live as the carriers of Jesus' prophecy.
-------------------------------------
Ok, so after talking about these few things that I see in Jesus, do you see what I mean when I say that the so what question is the most important? Do you see what I mean when I say that our lives must be lived in a way that reflect our beliefs, or we don't really believe what we say? Being a Christian is much more involved than just saying you believe something, or feeling different when you say that you accept Jesus into your heart, or going to church, or being a SUPER CHRISTIAN...... It is a life changing commitment that affects all areas of your life. Following Jesus involves hard work, learning, teaching, living with justice, righteousness, knowing God then, loving all, living in peace with all, and informing others what they are blinded to, which is the truth of these things and the lies of what is happening in the world we live in.
This is getting too long, but this is my answer to my questions. I know it was long, but it required a very intense look into what I believe. I could have written a 100 page paper on this or an entire book to fully explain this all with Bible passages, other references, and philosophical understanding. The point is that Jesus is my guide and savior and my role model and I think that as a Christian we must live like him and if we do not, then we are not Christians.........
I think that if we as Christians did live like him, then we wouldn't have a problem with people thinking we are hypocrites, hateful, judgemental, crazy, illogical, stupid, or anything else because of the way we lived..... they would think this way only because of Jesus........ this then would be what Jesus called for. Right now people don't hate Jesus they just hate the Christian that the church has created, one who does not reflect Jesus, and who does not live with the things listed above, especially love.
This then is when joy can fill someone, when real peace inside can happen, this is what Christianity is all about, when we actually live like Jesus taught us to....... Even if you are not a believer in the spiritual life of Jesus...... can you see what I am saying about him as a human and his teachings and why following him is a reasonable thing and something that can have a postitive affect on this world????
"I Pledge Allegiance to the Flag of the..." (A Basic Worldview Observation)
Before I get into the topic of this post, I want to say I'm sorry for bugging everyone by trying to get you all to post on here. Like I have said, it is my favorite thing to do theology, so I get passionate about it. I am just going to keep posting and assume someone is listening, so pleaase sit back and enjoy. I have also been told that I should start podcasting with my web cam...... I'll think about it....
(this one is going to be another long one which has many layers)
Within the past decade there has been a lot of fighting between Christians and the rest of the United States about taking God out of the Pledge of Allegiance. I am not sure how seriously any of you have debated this, but I have always just listened with intrigue to all sides. I understand both sides and never really cared about the issue that much...... until recently. I may have taken interest in a far different way than I have heard anyone else talk about though.
Point number 1: "You shall have no other gods than me". I think that this may sound unrelated to many of you, but let me explain. God is a jealous god, and he demands that you ultimately serve no one but him. This includes idols, money, ideas, actions, and so on..... dealing with this topic however the object that I am speaking of is the flag of the United States of America and the country itself; therefore I am speaking of "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands".
Do we as Christians understand what we are saying when we say this. whether the sentence has "under God" or not in it, we are pledging allegiance not to God, but to the flag and to America. Do we not see the hypocracy in this? Since God has commanded us to serve only him, in essence to pledge ourselves to him alone....., what are we thinking when we say this thing?
Ok, that is only the beginning of what I have to say, it is a much bigger problem than it seems like right now.
Point number 2: In most of the prophetic books in the Bible, especially Jeremiah, we see a picture of the Hebrew people who are not right with God. One of the main issues that God has with them in the book of Jeremiah has to do with nationalism and patriotism. Let me explain. Throughout the times of Jeremiah's prophecies the "people of God" continued to say that their nation was God's chosen nation and that they were the chosen people. However, God's words through Jeremiah told these people that although they say that their nation and people were God's, they are serving other gods, they are worshipping idols in God's temple, and that this was not acceptable!!! The mindset of these people were that because God started out Israel as his chosen country and because the Hebrew people were "the people", any choices that they made must be ordained by God. Therefore the mindset of the people was that anything that Israel did as a nation must be God's decision and anything that the Hebrew people collectively agreed upon must be God's word.
Now I could tie this into the fences thing (collective agreement making up what is right), and I could also tie this into the interpretation of the Bible (again collective agreement on what the Bible is and says), but for this post these things are not the point. the point is that we have historical information in the Bible which teaches us not to hold our nations so highly just because we say that God has chosen us or because we say that our nation was founded on the word of God.
Point number 3: Now if we take point number 1 and point number 2 together (as well as looking at the historical facts about.... the tower of Babyl, The Roman Empire, and so on...) we can see that God does not take kindly to nations thinking that they run the show. God does not like it when people take their allegiance off of him and choose to put their trust in ideologies and philosophies (like democracy, capitalism, American freedom, the constitution, the declaration of independence....). God has in the past destroyed nations, created diasporas, killed people, and turned his back on people temporarily because of these things (please read Jeremiah if you don't believe me. God chose to not listen to the cries of the people after they kept on rejecting his calling to turn their back on everything to love him). Yes God came back to his people, but only when they learned what was wrong with their ways.
What I am saying is that we are in serious trouble if we think that America is the solution to all of the worlds problems, we are in grave trouble if we pledge allegiance to this country whether it is based on God, or not, whether under God is in the pledge, or not, and whether we have a Christian president, or not.
Point number 4: Now to another serious topic. Many of you know that I am a pacifist, and that may be influencing greatly what I am about to write, but I still believe that it is what God is teaching me at this moment.
Because of this nationalism that many of us have, because we pledge allegiance to the flag and our nation, because we hang the flag outside our house more than we open the bible or pray, and because we trust in our country above most things in our lives, we are blinded. What I mean is that it seems as though for certain choices that our country makes, we as Christians are so willing to support these choices without thinking twice about what God says about it. We think that because this country is "under God", that our country's choices must be the best for our world. Now Christians do disagree on somethings, like abortion, gay marriage, and so on, but over time just like in the past, if we don't keep our eyes on God, the line will be blurred as to what God says and what our country wants.
The reason why I mentioned pacifism is because I wanted to talk about war. War is a situation where a country or people does something that ultimately another country or people doesn't like, and so the upset country retaliates with killing in order to get what it wants. Anyway you look at it that is exactly what war is, please try to tell me it isn't. Now lets take a look at this in a smaller scale. Let's say that someone does something so terrible and continues to do these terrible things that another person decides they have the right to retaliate with killing, not to mention that in order to kill that other person a few others have to be involved and get hurt an killed along the way. We as Christians would say that this action is selfish and motivated by pride and sin....... why then is it ok on a huge scale where thousands or millions are killed like in the case of war (this also brings to question capital punishment)? I will tell you that one of the basis' of this is nationalism and patriotism (which includes pride and selfishness).
Nationalism and patriotism to this country has blinded us to seeing the murder and sin that war is, even if our country has a good reason to do this....... aren't we taught that God is the Judge and Jury? Isn't God the one who is the one who is our savior and protector? Christians preach love and forgiveness, yet we support war with a passion, why is this?
Conclusion: I beg you to take a look at why you believe the way you do about these topics. I beg you to stop saying the Pledge of Allegiance... not because it does or doesn't have God in it, but because God doesn't want us pledging our allegiance to anything or anyone but him. I beg you to think about your stance on killing, pride, and war. Also, forgiveness, love, and the judgement of God and not us as the judge. I think that this post, again, will cause a lot of people to be angry and also to think hard. If you conclude something other than what I have said after rethinking and contemplating this seriously, then I have no reason to fight you on that choice. But, please do not do this without consulting our tool, the Bible, and the life of Christ.
I would also like to say that I think that this is the greatest country in the world. We have such a better life here then we would have anywhere else. I would not like to live anywhere else. I do however not agree with all the decisions that we have made, and the only reason is because of Christ, and my Christianity....... which this country currently gives me the right to follow. Because of this, I do not say the pledge and I do not hang the flag. I only have one God, and I only serve one master. I try to not judge, and I try to forgive, and I love all people whether they have hurt me or not. I pray and hope that our country and we as Christians would do the same thing. Someday if we do not, then God will pour his wrath out again like he did to Israel in the times of Jeremiah!
(this one is going to be another long one which has many layers)
Within the past decade there has been a lot of fighting between Christians and the rest of the United States about taking God out of the Pledge of Allegiance. I am not sure how seriously any of you have debated this, but I have always just listened with intrigue to all sides. I understand both sides and never really cared about the issue that much...... until recently. I may have taken interest in a far different way than I have heard anyone else talk about though.
Point number 1: "You shall have no other gods than me". I think that this may sound unrelated to many of you, but let me explain. God is a jealous god, and he demands that you ultimately serve no one but him. This includes idols, money, ideas, actions, and so on..... dealing with this topic however the object that I am speaking of is the flag of the United States of America and the country itself; therefore I am speaking of "I pledge allegiance to the flag of the United States of America and to the republic for which it stands".
Do we as Christians understand what we are saying when we say this. whether the sentence has "under God" or not in it, we are pledging allegiance not to God, but to the flag and to America. Do we not see the hypocracy in this? Since God has commanded us to serve only him, in essence to pledge ourselves to him alone....., what are we thinking when we say this thing?
Ok, that is only the beginning of what I have to say, it is a much bigger problem than it seems like right now.
Point number 2: In most of the prophetic books in the Bible, especially Jeremiah, we see a picture of the Hebrew people who are not right with God. One of the main issues that God has with them in the book of Jeremiah has to do with nationalism and patriotism. Let me explain. Throughout the times of Jeremiah's prophecies the "people of God" continued to say that their nation was God's chosen nation and that they were the chosen people. However, God's words through Jeremiah told these people that although they say that their nation and people were God's, they are serving other gods, they are worshipping idols in God's temple, and that this was not acceptable!!! The mindset of these people were that because God started out Israel as his chosen country and because the Hebrew people were "the people", any choices that they made must be ordained by God. Therefore the mindset of the people was that anything that Israel did as a nation must be God's decision and anything that the Hebrew people collectively agreed upon must be God's word.
Now I could tie this into the fences thing (collective agreement making up what is right), and I could also tie this into the interpretation of the Bible (again collective agreement on what the Bible is and says), but for this post these things are not the point. the point is that we have historical information in the Bible which teaches us not to hold our nations so highly just because we say that God has chosen us or because we say that our nation was founded on the word of God.
Point number 3: Now if we take point number 1 and point number 2 together (as well as looking at the historical facts about.... the tower of Babyl, The Roman Empire, and so on...) we can see that God does not take kindly to nations thinking that they run the show. God does not like it when people take their allegiance off of him and choose to put their trust in ideologies and philosophies (like democracy, capitalism, American freedom, the constitution, the declaration of independence....). God has in the past destroyed nations, created diasporas, killed people, and turned his back on people temporarily because of these things (please read Jeremiah if you don't believe me. God chose to not listen to the cries of the people after they kept on rejecting his calling to turn their back on everything to love him). Yes God came back to his people, but only when they learned what was wrong with their ways.
What I am saying is that we are in serious trouble if we think that America is the solution to all of the worlds problems, we are in grave trouble if we pledge allegiance to this country whether it is based on God, or not, whether under God is in the pledge, or not, and whether we have a Christian president, or not.
Point number 4: Now to another serious topic. Many of you know that I am a pacifist, and that may be influencing greatly what I am about to write, but I still believe that it is what God is teaching me at this moment.
Because of this nationalism that many of us have, because we pledge allegiance to the flag and our nation, because we hang the flag outside our house more than we open the bible or pray, and because we trust in our country above most things in our lives, we are blinded. What I mean is that it seems as though for certain choices that our country makes, we as Christians are so willing to support these choices without thinking twice about what God says about it. We think that because this country is "under God", that our country's choices must be the best for our world. Now Christians do disagree on somethings, like abortion, gay marriage, and so on, but over time just like in the past, if we don't keep our eyes on God, the line will be blurred as to what God says and what our country wants.
The reason why I mentioned pacifism is because I wanted to talk about war. War is a situation where a country or people does something that ultimately another country or people doesn't like, and so the upset country retaliates with killing in order to get what it wants. Anyway you look at it that is exactly what war is, please try to tell me it isn't. Now lets take a look at this in a smaller scale. Let's say that someone does something so terrible and continues to do these terrible things that another person decides they have the right to retaliate with killing, not to mention that in order to kill that other person a few others have to be involved and get hurt an killed along the way. We as Christians would say that this action is selfish and motivated by pride and sin....... why then is it ok on a huge scale where thousands or millions are killed like in the case of war (this also brings to question capital punishment)? I will tell you that one of the basis' of this is nationalism and patriotism (which includes pride and selfishness).
Nationalism and patriotism to this country has blinded us to seeing the murder and sin that war is, even if our country has a good reason to do this....... aren't we taught that God is the Judge and Jury? Isn't God the one who is the one who is our savior and protector? Christians preach love and forgiveness, yet we support war with a passion, why is this?
Conclusion: I beg you to take a look at why you believe the way you do about these topics. I beg you to stop saying the Pledge of Allegiance... not because it does or doesn't have God in it, but because God doesn't want us pledging our allegiance to anything or anyone but him. I beg you to think about your stance on killing, pride, and war. Also, forgiveness, love, and the judgement of God and not us as the judge. I think that this post, again, will cause a lot of people to be angry and also to think hard. If you conclude something other than what I have said after rethinking and contemplating this seriously, then I have no reason to fight you on that choice. But, please do not do this without consulting our tool, the Bible, and the life of Christ.
I would also like to say that I think that this is the greatest country in the world. We have such a better life here then we would have anywhere else. I would not like to live anywhere else. I do however not agree with all the decisions that we have made, and the only reason is because of Christ, and my Christianity....... which this country currently gives me the right to follow. Because of this, I do not say the pledge and I do not hang the flag. I only have one God, and I only serve one master. I try to not judge, and I try to forgive, and I love all people whether they have hurt me or not. I pray and hope that our country and we as Christians would do the same thing. Someday if we do not, then God will pour his wrath out again like he did to Israel in the times of Jeremiah!
Education
I've been thinking about a few things lately, and helping my brother in law Tyler study last night really set me off.
He is in middle school science, which granted cannot be the deepest and in depth study, but there is nothing meaningful being taught. We were going through flash cards to study information about the Periodic Table, and with a little help Tyler knew all of the answers. However I know somethings about the Periodic Table and decided to test the waters about the cohesiveness and real understanding of what the table really tells someone.
Ok so you know how there are so called energy levels outside the nucleus of an atom.... and each layer can only hold a certain amount of electrons, right? That is 2, 6, 10, 14....... (2n^2). Now I don't expect Tyler to know the equation, but he did know the total if each layer was filled to max; 2, 8, 18.... So I asked the question, "If an electron layer is not filled to capacity, what then does the nucleus, the protons and neutrons, seeks to do to become stable?" Tyler immediately shouted, "that's not on the test!"
Ok, so the next logical progression for his science class is going towards compounds, and combining elements together. Maybe they just haven't gotten as far as studying the meaning of how many electrons each atom has yet, but what concerns me most is Tyler's answer to my question. "That's not on the test!" Only shows me that the teacher, or the student, or the school, or the whole system itself doesn't care what we actually know cohesively. My guess, educated guess, is that the whole system doesn't care what we know cohesively, it only cares that we can memorize and repeat facts when it comes time to test. Which then makes schools not care, teachers not care, and then ultimately students not care.
Ok, now the implications and connections I can make from this are vast and can be spun off into any area of our society, but for the sake of our time here let's take it to the education of the Church. (You all know that when I talk about the Church I am talking about all of us collective followers of Christ, right?)
Ok so let's say the same situation happens, except the class is Sunday school or Sunday service itself for adults, and the flash cards are questions about the Bible. Let's say someone knows all the answers that they have memorized from reading and learning about the Bible. However, if I were to ask a question that digs deeper than the content at hand by asking a question like:
"so taking the situations and interaction between God and man in that story, and the circumstance we are in now, what implications can we implement into our theology and lifestyle today?",
Would we be able to discern real meaning from the collective stories in the Bible, or can we just shoot out verse after verse of "useless information"? We also learn all the routines and traditions of our particular congregation, if were thrown out of our element and another diaspora happened, would we understand the real purpose of these things and continue on with our journey with God even without those routines and traditions?
Or are we a group that sticks to the flash cards..... not really worrying about the relationship we have with our God? Do we only care about the grade we get on the test, or even just passing the test, as opposed to not caring about the grade, or reward, or recognition we may get, and only caring about our relationships with God? Isn't that the point of it all? Isn't that why we study the flash cards, to get the real cohesive picture to influence the meaningful and influential part of our walk?
He is in middle school science, which granted cannot be the deepest and in depth study, but there is nothing meaningful being taught. We were going through flash cards to study information about the Periodic Table, and with a little help Tyler knew all of the answers. However I know somethings about the Periodic Table and decided to test the waters about the cohesiveness and real understanding of what the table really tells someone.
Ok so you know how there are so called energy levels outside the nucleus of an atom.... and each layer can only hold a certain amount of electrons, right? That is 2, 6, 10, 14....... (2n^2). Now I don't expect Tyler to know the equation, but he did know the total if each layer was filled to max; 2, 8, 18.... So I asked the question, "If an electron layer is not filled to capacity, what then does the nucleus, the protons and neutrons, seeks to do to become stable?" Tyler immediately shouted, "that's not on the test!"
Ok, so the next logical progression for his science class is going towards compounds, and combining elements together. Maybe they just haven't gotten as far as studying the meaning of how many electrons each atom has yet, but what concerns me most is Tyler's answer to my question. "That's not on the test!" Only shows me that the teacher, or the student, or the school, or the whole system itself doesn't care what we actually know cohesively. My guess, educated guess, is that the whole system doesn't care what we know cohesively, it only cares that we can memorize and repeat facts when it comes time to test. Which then makes schools not care, teachers not care, and then ultimately students not care.
Ok, now the implications and connections I can make from this are vast and can be spun off into any area of our society, but for the sake of our time here let's take it to the education of the Church. (You all know that when I talk about the Church I am talking about all of us collective followers of Christ, right?)
Ok so let's say the same situation happens, except the class is Sunday school or Sunday service itself for adults, and the flash cards are questions about the Bible. Let's say someone knows all the answers that they have memorized from reading and learning about the Bible. However, if I were to ask a question that digs deeper than the content at hand by asking a question like:
"so taking the situations and interaction between God and man in that story, and the circumstance we are in now, what implications can we implement into our theology and lifestyle today?",
Would we be able to discern real meaning from the collective stories in the Bible, or can we just shoot out verse after verse of "useless information"? We also learn all the routines and traditions of our particular congregation, if were thrown out of our element and another diaspora happened, would we understand the real purpose of these things and continue on with our journey with God even without those routines and traditions?
Or are we a group that sticks to the flash cards..... not really worrying about the relationship we have with our God? Do we only care about the grade we get on the test, or even just passing the test, as opposed to not caring about the grade, or reward, or recognition we may get, and only caring about our relationships with God? Isn't that the point of it all? Isn't that why we study the flash cards, to get the real cohesive picture to influence the meaningful and influential part of our walk?
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How Do You Use the Bible? (Also Genesis Understanding)
So far so good guys and girls. We are definately getting some good conversation.
Instead of responding to "Attum" in the "fences" post I decided to start a new post since the conversation is leading to a more specific topic.
The topic is moving toward the inspiration, authority, translation, exegesis, and interpretation of the Bible. Harry brought up the idea that science seems to be trying to find ways which it can make the Bible untrue, or depending on how you look at it, science has found things that seem to be leading towards having us interpret the Bible in deifferent ways. Which one do you think?
I think that what harry is saying leads us to think negatively of science and its findings, even if what they find is unrelated, we do have to take a look at what our faith is actually founded upon. Let us say that what Harry says is true and the sea never parted for Moses. What does that do for your faith. I feel that if your faith is shaken just because some particulars are shattered, then your faith is not solid and your foundation was never on The Triune God and his love. Your foundation may be on the book that is the Bible. Just because the Bible is the "word of God", no matter how you look at it, it can and never was meant to be the ground which you stand upon. The ground on which you stand upon should be the truths and message that it teaches us. That message is what Christ teaches. Love God and love your neighbor. Is that what your foundation is..... is it love?
One of the major topics of discussion and debate is the Genesis story. Now Attum has expressed his opinion of Genesis, and from the way our lives our lived and what our culture is accustomed too it may be easy to pass Genesis off as just weird stories which were passed down. I could write a lot about why I don't think this is the case but it is not important as long as Attum gets the point of why the Bible is even there, which is to get God's message accross.
In short, The Genesis story seems to have originated after the story of Gilgamesh, and Marduk, and other Ancient Near Eastern Texts were very integrated into the lives of the people of Assyria, Babylon and the people from south of those places which included the people who created and recorded the stories of Genesis. The myths that I mentioned before were creation myths which were based upon bloodshed, war, selfish gods, and human slavery to those gods. In what I have studied the Biblical story, which came after that of the other Ancient Near Eastern Texts, is an attempt change the worldview of humanity. Technically it is a critique on the other stories. The story tellers are trying to change the mindset that we were created with selfish intent, because of war, and with blood shed, with the intent of slavery. The biblical story is a story of love and heaven and earth are places of things that are "great" in the eyes of God. There was nothing like that in the ANET's. The story of the tower of Babyl (Babylon), the story of Cain and Abel, and others are a clue into what the mindset of bablylon and Assyria were like because of what their myths taught them about gods and themselves. It taught that bigger is better, the more you do for God the better off you will be, the closer you are to being a god the less of a slave you are and the more they are pleased with you, and with bloodshed you can solve problems which otherwise cannot be solved.
The Biblical stories in Genesis are actually critiques in order to change the worldview of the reader into being a loving creature based on how the story shows that God's interactions with us are not based on his selfishness and his lust for our blood and work, but on his love for us and his yearning for us to also love him and the rest of his creation.
I think that with this brief introduction to the text of Genesis you can see why I disagree with Attum's summation. But, although other readers may not know who Attum is, I know that even without him caring about Genesis, he still gets the message of what God is longing for. This leads me to the idea again of the debate about Creation and Evolution, and also everything in between. Do you all think that it is necessary for a Christian to believe in a literal 7 day creation?
I have thought about this a lot, and have concluded that I don't know. Although I find it harder and harder to see a point in standing firmly one way or the other. The point is, is the message getting through. Are we as humans seeing that God loves us, and that he wants us to love him and the rest of earth as well? Are we seeing that God, no matter how he did it, has worked out heaven and earth to be the way that they are, which in his mind are great! Beyond that, again I think that what harry says and what I commented on about your foundation comes into play here, where will you stand if somehow you find out that a belief in a 7 day creation is not the truth? Will your faith in the Triune God be shattered, or will you still stand firm even though what you thought was correct was not? Where will you be if you find out that the 7 day creation actually did happen and you have been thinking wrong the whole time? Is your foundation on that belief or are you standing on the love of God?
That is the point of the Bible. It is not there to tell you what to believe for the most part. It is there to guide you on your journey of life and faith. If we focus too much on those TOOLS which are there to lead us to righteousness and God, then we don't get to see who God actually is, and we don't get to see and use that love which he has been yearning for us since he showed himself to us.
Again this conversation leads to the questions of the inspiration of the Bible's writers, the authority of its "dogmas", and so on...... but again I say to you, if you understand the point of the Bible, then those things, once understood that it is a tool for our use from God to help us, truly become pointless to argue about. As long as the message is understood, the Bible has done its job. When the Bible is not doing its job though, is precisely when we misinterpret, fail to exegete correctly, and because of these things create fences, dogmas, "truths" which are not, and a Christianity which misses the point of the tool of the Bible in the first place.
Jesus was and is the word of God. The Bible is not. Jesus did not send the Bible to be our helper after his death and ressurection, he sent the Holy Spirit. Jesus is full of Grace and truth and life and light according to these verses in John. The Bible is not said to be these things here. Is your faith in God the Father, God the Son and Word, and God the Holy Spirit............ or is it in the Bible?
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all people. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
John 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
Thank you all for posting, and I am excited to see what everyone thinks about what I just wrote, because it seems blasphemous, but if you really look at what I am saying you will understand that I am seeking the God of the Bible at the heart of what I am saying and nothing else!!
(P.S. I use the Bible in my daily Christian walk, and I think that it is the best physical tool that we can use to find God's path. I also think that I am human and I hope I don't offend those who think differently than I. Let's just talk about it and see where we get. Ultimately I think we will find that we agree on more than we disagree, especially when it comes to the point of all of this.)
Instead of responding to "Attum" in the "fences" post I decided to start a new post since the conversation is leading to a more specific topic.
The topic is moving toward the inspiration, authority, translation, exegesis, and interpretation of the Bible. Harry brought up the idea that science seems to be trying to find ways which it can make the Bible untrue, or depending on how you look at it, science has found things that seem to be leading towards having us interpret the Bible in deifferent ways. Which one do you think?
I think that what harry is saying leads us to think negatively of science and its findings, even if what they find is unrelated, we do have to take a look at what our faith is actually founded upon. Let us say that what Harry says is true and the sea never parted for Moses. What does that do for your faith. I feel that if your faith is shaken just because some particulars are shattered, then your faith is not solid and your foundation was never on The Triune God and his love. Your foundation may be on the book that is the Bible. Just because the Bible is the "word of God", no matter how you look at it, it can and never was meant to be the ground which you stand upon. The ground on which you stand upon should be the truths and message that it teaches us. That message is what Christ teaches. Love God and love your neighbor. Is that what your foundation is..... is it love?
One of the major topics of discussion and debate is the Genesis story. Now Attum has expressed his opinion of Genesis, and from the way our lives our lived and what our culture is accustomed too it may be easy to pass Genesis off as just weird stories which were passed down. I could write a lot about why I don't think this is the case but it is not important as long as Attum gets the point of why the Bible is even there, which is to get God's message accross.
In short, The Genesis story seems to have originated after the story of Gilgamesh, and Marduk, and other Ancient Near Eastern Texts were very integrated into the lives of the people of Assyria, Babylon and the people from south of those places which included the people who created and recorded the stories of Genesis. The myths that I mentioned before were creation myths which were based upon bloodshed, war, selfish gods, and human slavery to those gods. In what I have studied the Biblical story, which came after that of the other Ancient Near Eastern Texts, is an attempt change the worldview of humanity. Technically it is a critique on the other stories. The story tellers are trying to change the mindset that we were created with selfish intent, because of war, and with blood shed, with the intent of slavery. The biblical story is a story of love and heaven and earth are places of things that are "great" in the eyes of God. There was nothing like that in the ANET's. The story of the tower of Babyl (Babylon), the story of Cain and Abel, and others are a clue into what the mindset of bablylon and Assyria were like because of what their myths taught them about gods and themselves. It taught that bigger is better, the more you do for God the better off you will be, the closer you are to being a god the less of a slave you are and the more they are pleased with you, and with bloodshed you can solve problems which otherwise cannot be solved.
The Biblical stories in Genesis are actually critiques in order to change the worldview of the reader into being a loving creature based on how the story shows that God's interactions with us are not based on his selfishness and his lust for our blood and work, but on his love for us and his yearning for us to also love him and the rest of his creation.
I think that with this brief introduction to the text of Genesis you can see why I disagree with Attum's summation. But, although other readers may not know who Attum is, I know that even without him caring about Genesis, he still gets the message of what God is longing for. This leads me to the idea again of the debate about Creation and Evolution, and also everything in between. Do you all think that it is necessary for a Christian to believe in a literal 7 day creation?
I have thought about this a lot, and have concluded that I don't know. Although I find it harder and harder to see a point in standing firmly one way or the other. The point is, is the message getting through. Are we as humans seeing that God loves us, and that he wants us to love him and the rest of earth as well? Are we seeing that God, no matter how he did it, has worked out heaven and earth to be the way that they are, which in his mind are great! Beyond that, again I think that what harry says and what I commented on about your foundation comes into play here, where will you stand if somehow you find out that a belief in a 7 day creation is not the truth? Will your faith in the Triune God be shattered, or will you still stand firm even though what you thought was correct was not? Where will you be if you find out that the 7 day creation actually did happen and you have been thinking wrong the whole time? Is your foundation on that belief or are you standing on the love of God?
That is the point of the Bible. It is not there to tell you what to believe for the most part. It is there to guide you on your journey of life and faith. If we focus too much on those TOOLS which are there to lead us to righteousness and God, then we don't get to see who God actually is, and we don't get to see and use that love which he has been yearning for us since he showed himself to us.
Again this conversation leads to the questions of the inspiration of the Bible's writers, the authority of its "dogmas", and so on...... but again I say to you, if you understand the point of the Bible, then those things, once understood that it is a tool for our use from God to help us, truly become pointless to argue about. As long as the message is understood, the Bible has done its job. When the Bible is not doing its job though, is precisely when we misinterpret, fail to exegete correctly, and because of these things create fences, dogmas, "truths" which are not, and a Christianity which misses the point of the tool of the Bible in the first place.
Jesus was and is the word of God. The Bible is not. Jesus did not send the Bible to be our helper after his death and ressurection, he sent the Holy Spirit. Jesus is full of Grace and truth and life and light according to these verses in John. The Bible is not said to be these things here. Is your faith in God the Father, God the Son and Word, and God the Holy Spirit............ or is it in the Bible?
John 1:1 In the beginning was the Word, and the Word was with God, and the Word was God. 2 He was with God in the beginning. 3 Through him all things were made; without him nothing was made that has been made. 4 In him was life, and that life was the light of all people. 5 The light shines in the darkness, and the darkness has not overcome it.
John 1:14 The Word became flesh and made his dwelling among us. We have seen his glory, the glory of the one and only, who came from the Father, full of grace and truth.
Thank you all for posting, and I am excited to see what everyone thinks about what I just wrote, because it seems blasphemous, but if you really look at what I am saying you will understand that I am seeking the God of the Bible at the heart of what I am saying and nothing else!!
(P.S. I use the Bible in my daily Christian walk, and I think that it is the best physical tool that we can use to find God's path. I also think that I am human and I hope I don't offend those who think differently than I. Let's just talk about it and see where we get. Ultimately I think we will find that we agree on more than we disagree, especially when it comes to the point of all of this.)
Obama is a Socialist and/or a Communist!!!!!
I keep hearing everyone (Christians) getting nervous about our president and the decisions that he has been making with regards to our economy and our way of life. They are saying that he is a socialist and that he is going to drive our nation into even more debt; that he is un-American (which cannot be possible). So I have been thinking about this a bit and had a conversation with my friend which sparked a few thoughts.
First of all you should read my post entitled "I pledge allegiance to the flag.........." and you will get further insight into this topic. Let dig into the foundation of why Christians are saying these things about our president. As stated in past posts, for the most part Christians support that which America does to fullest without much questioning, especially after the fact. This means that democracy must be the way that God wants us to have government.... and so on (read my prior post). Pertaining to this post, this means that God wants us to have a capitalistic economy!
If Christians believe that capitalism is the way God wants us to live and work, then anything that goes against that must not only be un-American but also against the will of God. So, let's look at capitalism and see if it is what God wants us to be practicing.
At the basis of capitalism is survival of the fittest. The business, or the person, that is in the capitalist system is striving to be the best at what he does in order to be better than the competition so that it can survive to make a profit and then take that profit and make itself better to create sustainability and more profitability, which then creates stability in growth. Capitalism rewards those that are the best at what they do, and defeats those which do not do it as well. Never the less the goal is profitability and sustainability.
The capitalistic society is based on money. This is the reward for being the best, or better than someone else. This money is either stockpiled, put back into the business or agenda for more profit, or both is done. So those that succeed in this economy have money, and those that fail have less and less as it goes down the line. Capitalism supports technological growth, economical growth, and all kinds of growth only as it pertains to someone making a profit. This is why we have cars that fall apart after so many years, and why we have new models every year, instead of cars that last a life time with little or no repair; there is no profit in making something that lasts forever. This is why everything we buy will eventually need to be replaced by something else that will not last..... there is no profit in making something so good that lasts (reminds me of that stride gum commercial.) This is the same reason why we are still running cars on gasoline when we should be running cars on a no waste technology that we do have. Then the Oil giants would stop making profit, which means then those that are in power need to make different allies.... and that is just messy..... you can determine your own logical connections I am sure. Never the less the reward is solely for those which are apart of the business or agenda that is surviving or is the most fit.
Those that are surviving the best and making the most profit are then the ones that have the power in a government that depends upon a budget and monetary responsibilities and monetary expenses. These capitalists may not be the direct faces that we see as the leaders of our country, but they do run the show (as you can see a little bit of recently with the failure of the car industries and the banking industries). Therefore Capitalism and Democracy play very well together. Never the less..... those that receive the reward of profitability and sustainability also indirectly receive power.
OK, so that is a basic breakdown of Capitalism (of course in sort of a biased view but never the less, nothing I said is false I do not believe.) As it pertains to Christianity, we must look at the teachings of Jesus and the Bible. I am sure you must know the Beatitudes... the meek will inherit, the poor will inherit... and so on. I am sure you know the idea that the first is last and the last is first. I think I wrote a post on suffering being the result of believing God and what Jesus stands for, you should read all of my posts to know more about what I think Christianity is or is missing.
You should as a Christian also know that servanthood and sacrifice for the poor and needy, the weak, the orphans, the widows, and so on is what it means to know God (Jeremiah 23). You should also know that as a Christian you should not store up your treasures here on earth.... (these are things that are not rules to obey but changes that happen in your life when you are truly in a relationship with God.) Christianity preaches that it is harder for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven than it is....... it teaches that selfishness and a yearning for things of this world are signs of a heart that has been turned away from God.
Basically Christianity should teach that survival of the fittest is not something that God supports, that the gaining of profits and storing of profits is not something that God supports, that the yearning for power and control should be given solely by God and should not be determined by monetary value or contributions. Summed up, I think that Christianity does not support capitalism, in fact it is precisely the opposite..... it is against it.
I am not doing this to support Obama, I actually only used that title to get some of you to read this, because I know it is a touchy subject for most of us. I am doing this again to show the fences that we put up as Christians which hold us back from living fully in a relationship with God (read my post on the fences that we put up).
If you objectively, if that is possible, read about real socialism or communism.... you may see that Jesus would most likely support those over capitalism. I know that hurts some of you to read, but you must separate the history of these two ideas from the actual ideas of socialism and communism. I am not supporting anything that has happened in history, just questioning whether our society is seeking truth from God, or seeking our own wills.
I don't know a solution to this thing that I think is a problem, but I think that maybe recognizing that it is a problem may spark us as a whole to do something about it. I think that Obama may realize at least partly that capitalism breeds deceit, dishonesty, greed, self-interest, and ultimately pertaining to economy and our country, quick and easy progress but long-term problems and moral confusion as it pertains to self interests and what is right and wrong when it comes to possessions and other people. Profit runs the country, and its leaders. Profit rules the world. Profit even has infiltrated the Church and Christianity. Who has more people in their church? Which church is expanding its walls? Which church has sustainability when it comes to monetary success? Is the Church of Blessing the true Church of Christ? Is health, wellness, wealth, comfort, answering of prayers really the result of being a Christian? The idea of Profit and and earned rewards has infiltrated the teachings of the Bible enough so that we as the church now pray the prayer of Jabez and expect that because we confess Jesus, we are entitled to blessings and entitled to be the economic leaders of society. When in fact if you read the Bible, those that follow Christ are to lay down all of their possessions to follow him. Those that followed Christ in the Bible became poor, broken, beat up physically, outcasts...... (Jesus, Paul, Stephen, John......... and so on and so on). How does Christianity supporting capitalism reveal the truth of Christ???
I'd like to see what some of you think about this topic. I wrote this on a whim.... so judge me as so. I'll write a research paper if you'd like!!! Please respond with you comments, ideas, concerns, and so on. (remember many of my arguments have been made before in other posts, so if you haven't read them yet, it may help you to understand where I am coming from on some of these issues.)
First of all you should read my post entitled "I pledge allegiance to the flag.........." and you will get further insight into this topic. Let dig into the foundation of why Christians are saying these things about our president. As stated in past posts, for the most part Christians support that which America does to fullest without much questioning, especially after the fact. This means that democracy must be the way that God wants us to have government.... and so on (read my prior post). Pertaining to this post, this means that God wants us to have a capitalistic economy!
If Christians believe that capitalism is the way God wants us to live and work, then anything that goes against that must not only be un-American but also against the will of God. So, let's look at capitalism and see if it is what God wants us to be practicing.
At the basis of capitalism is survival of the fittest. The business, or the person, that is in the capitalist system is striving to be the best at what he does in order to be better than the competition so that it can survive to make a profit and then take that profit and make itself better to create sustainability and more profitability, which then creates stability in growth. Capitalism rewards those that are the best at what they do, and defeats those which do not do it as well. Never the less the goal is profitability and sustainability.
The capitalistic society is based on money. This is the reward for being the best, or better than someone else. This money is either stockpiled, put back into the business or agenda for more profit, or both is done. So those that succeed in this economy have money, and those that fail have less and less as it goes down the line. Capitalism supports technological growth, economical growth, and all kinds of growth only as it pertains to someone making a profit. This is why we have cars that fall apart after so many years, and why we have new models every year, instead of cars that last a life time with little or no repair; there is no profit in making something that lasts forever. This is why everything we buy will eventually need to be replaced by something else that will not last..... there is no profit in making something so good that lasts (reminds me of that stride gum commercial.) This is the same reason why we are still running cars on gasoline when we should be running cars on a no waste technology that we do have. Then the Oil giants would stop making profit, which means then those that are in power need to make different allies.... and that is just messy..... you can determine your own logical connections I am sure. Never the less the reward is solely for those which are apart of the business or agenda that is surviving or is the most fit.
Those that are surviving the best and making the most profit are then the ones that have the power in a government that depends upon a budget and monetary responsibilities and monetary expenses. These capitalists may not be the direct faces that we see as the leaders of our country, but they do run the show (as you can see a little bit of recently with the failure of the car industries and the banking industries). Therefore Capitalism and Democracy play very well together. Never the less..... those that receive the reward of profitability and sustainability also indirectly receive power.
OK, so that is a basic breakdown of Capitalism (of course in sort of a biased view but never the less, nothing I said is false I do not believe.) As it pertains to Christianity, we must look at the teachings of Jesus and the Bible. I am sure you must know the Beatitudes... the meek will inherit, the poor will inherit... and so on. I am sure you know the idea that the first is last and the last is first. I think I wrote a post on suffering being the result of believing God and what Jesus stands for, you should read all of my posts to know more about what I think Christianity is or is missing.
You should as a Christian also know that servanthood and sacrifice for the poor and needy, the weak, the orphans, the widows, and so on is what it means to know God (Jeremiah 23). You should also know that as a Christian you should not store up your treasures here on earth.... (these are things that are not rules to obey but changes that happen in your life when you are truly in a relationship with God.) Christianity preaches that it is harder for a rich man to enter the kingdom of heaven than it is....... it teaches that selfishness and a yearning for things of this world are signs of a heart that has been turned away from God.
Basically Christianity should teach that survival of the fittest is not something that God supports, that the gaining of profits and storing of profits is not something that God supports, that the yearning for power and control should be given solely by God and should not be determined by monetary value or contributions. Summed up, I think that Christianity does not support capitalism, in fact it is precisely the opposite..... it is against it.
I am not doing this to support Obama, I actually only used that title to get some of you to read this, because I know it is a touchy subject for most of us. I am doing this again to show the fences that we put up as Christians which hold us back from living fully in a relationship with God (read my post on the fences that we put up).
If you objectively, if that is possible, read about real socialism or communism.... you may see that Jesus would most likely support those over capitalism. I know that hurts some of you to read, but you must separate the history of these two ideas from the actual ideas of socialism and communism. I am not supporting anything that has happened in history, just questioning whether our society is seeking truth from God, or seeking our own wills.
I don't know a solution to this thing that I think is a problem, but I think that maybe recognizing that it is a problem may spark us as a whole to do something about it. I think that Obama may realize at least partly that capitalism breeds deceit, dishonesty, greed, self-interest, and ultimately pertaining to economy and our country, quick and easy progress but long-term problems and moral confusion as it pertains to self interests and what is right and wrong when it comes to possessions and other people. Profit runs the country, and its leaders. Profit rules the world. Profit even has infiltrated the Church and Christianity. Who has more people in their church? Which church is expanding its walls? Which church has sustainability when it comes to monetary success? Is the Church of Blessing the true Church of Christ? Is health, wellness, wealth, comfort, answering of prayers really the result of being a Christian? The idea of Profit and and earned rewards has infiltrated the teachings of the Bible enough so that we as the church now pray the prayer of Jabez and expect that because we confess Jesus, we are entitled to blessings and entitled to be the economic leaders of society. When in fact if you read the Bible, those that follow Christ are to lay down all of their possessions to follow him. Those that followed Christ in the Bible became poor, broken, beat up physically, outcasts...... (Jesus, Paul, Stephen, John......... and so on and so on). How does Christianity supporting capitalism reveal the truth of Christ???
I'd like to see what some of you think about this topic. I wrote this on a whim.... so judge me as so. I'll write a research paper if you'd like!!! Please respond with you comments, ideas, concerns, and so on. (remember many of my arguments have been made before in other posts, so if you haven't read them yet, it may help you to understand where I am coming from on some of these issues.)
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